|
Comment on this article |
View comments |
Email this Article
|
|
News :: Miscellaneous |
|
:the fighting whities: |
Current rating: 2 |
by prepared
(No verified email address) |
14 Mar 2002
Modified: 20 Mar 2002 |
Michael Moore is coming to town! check his new book
"Stupid White Men"!
http://www.michaelmoore.com |
Julio Ochoa, Greeley Tribune, CO:
An intramural basketball team at the University of Northern Colorado
called "The Fighting Whities" is turning the tables on the Eaton mascot issue. Led by Solomon Little Owl, director of Native American Student Services at UNC, the team chose a white man as its mascot to raise
awareness and understanding of stereotypes that some cultures endure. "The message is, let's do something that will let people see the other side of
what it's like to be a mascot," Little Owl said. "I am really offended by this mascot issue, and I hope the people that support the Eaton mascot will get offended by this." The players, made up of a mixture of American Indian, Hispanic and Caucasian students, wear white jerseys with the
picture of a white man in a suit on the front and the slogan "Every thang's gonna be all white!" printed beneath. "It's not meant to be vicious, it is meant to be humorous," said Ray White [sic], a Mohawk
American Indian on the team. "It puts people in our shoes, and then we can say, 'Now you know how it is, and now you can make a judgment.' " |
See also:
http://www.larrycarlson.com
|
Comments
|
mm hmm |
by loserfest
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
15 Mar 2002
|
It's not meant to be vicious, it is meant to be humorous," said Ray
White [sic], a Mohawk
American Indian on the team.
but what the creators of the chief meant is irrelevant |
|
Love the Humor |
by Robert Cole
graverobber67ss (nospam) aol.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
15 Mar 2002
|
As a White Guy, I find the use of the Fighting Whities quite humorous. I have always said, If you can't laugh at yourself, you can't laugh at anyone else. The Use of Logo's and slogans in sports teams in my opinion are not ment to slander or offend any one group of people. It's only when Hate Groups use them against any group of people or individual, is when I find them offensive. I salute you on your creativity and as soon as I get my VISA paid down in 2 weeks, I intend to order a shirt as I find the Money going for Schalorships for native American is a very worthy Cause.
Robert L. Cole
Frederick Maryland
Graverobber67ss (at) aol.com |
|
Proud |
by Matthew Jaffke
jaffke_matthew (nospam) lacoe.edu (unverified) |
Current rating: 3
15 Mar 2002
|
I don't get it. I am white (caucasian for anyone who prefers the PC term) and feel absolutely nothing negative about a team's desire to name their mascot after my ethnicity. In fact, a team's mascot is a statement of pride, not predjudice, hatred or ethnic slander. A team's mascot is a reflection of that team's competitive nature through the positive elements of that mascot. If people can't recognize that, they are taking the practice of team mascots a little too seriously...and that takes the fun out of sports.
Grow up and stop looking for a reason to gripe at the world. |
|
the "Hammering Honkies" |
by Overly Hackled
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
15 Mar 2002
Modified: 18 Mar 2002 |
Can I sell t- shirts too and make money to send poor white trash to ESL classes? I am forming a rural Tractor Pull team.
Our moto is "Help Pull a Honkie Up"
Hell if were going to kill the PC bigots , might as well make a buck right! |
|
Fighting Whities No Insult |
by Michael D. Castle
warlock68 (nospam) msn.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
15 Mar 2002
|
|
I have to tell you, the mascot "Fighting Whities" is just about the funniest mascot I have seen in about 20 years. Where it was probably meant to awaken awareness of stereo-types, the mascot will probably become a thing of great pride for the members of this team. Even though some stereo-types are very derogatory, not all are. This one is sure to bring smiles from all who become aware of it, regardless of skin color. I hope those who have argued against American Indian mascots take a lesson from the reaction of those whose insult this was meant to be. If you cannot laugh at yourself from time to time, you are taking life way too seriously. God created the sense of humor. Let's embrace it. Kudos to the Fighting Whities team. |
|
Don't expect them to "get it" |
by Raphael Szykowski
gordolobo59 (nospam) hotmail.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
15 Mar 2002
|
|
People who come from privilege are not going to understand the point of turning the tables on them. For White men (or women) to be offended at a Fighting Whities mascot, they must understand the experience of cultural humiliation for multiple generations. White privilege by definition imputes that no such trauma occurs with them on a massive scale for centuries at a time through the present. Does it piss me off that small town/rural Christian Americans (or conservative academics nationwide for that matter) "don't get it"? Well, yeah. But all my life, White folks and Black folks have made fun of my hook nose and argued that I was "just too sensitive". "You look just like Chief Wahoo", they'd say. These are the same folks that fly American flags and sport god bless the USA bumper stickers on their cars. We're trying to convince them to abandon the tradition they've always known. It is their privilege to be White. Why would anyone want to give up their cushy position? Of course they don't get it. It doesn't serve their needs to get it. |
|
I am HONORED by the Tshirt |
by TD
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
15 Mar 2002
|
I am a proud White Man and am HONORED to have the T-shirt!!!
I wish we could have schools called: THE WHITE school!! |
|
I like it |
by Jim Thomasson
Jim_Thomasson (nospam) yahoo.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
15 Mar 2002
|
I'm not offended. I like it! White guys were tough and smart. We abolished slavery. We built civilization. We are the world's only Superpower because we worked our butts off to make it. This is the greatest country there ever was. There has never been prosperity like this in the past. There isn't prosperity like this anywhere else in the world. This is the best lifestyle and standard of living that people have ever achieved.
I'm sure we will make a good mascot for your team.
White guys abolished slavery. White guys. Not black guys. Not any commie guys. Judeo-Christian American white guys. We fought a war over slavery. Six hundred thousand good men died in order to abolish slavery. The world (other than Islamic and communist countries) is free from slavery today because Americans abolished it. If we hadn't fought a war over it, or if we had lost, then there would still be rampant slavery in the world today.
You should thank us for that.
So, what do you do? You brag about your left-wing socialism. Socialism is slavery. Communism is a slave society. You are re-inventing slavery! It took millenia to abolish slavery; and now you want it back again.
Centralized planning is the system that DOESN'T work.
Capitalism is the only economic system that works.
Where does wealth come from? It does not come from mineral or agricultural resources. It does not come from hard work. It does not come by stealing it from poor people. Wealth comes from creativity and problem-solving. You have to figure out how to get the minerals out of the ground, refine them, make something out of it, transport it to market, and find someone who wants to buy your products. Stupid people can't do that. Smart people do that. Wealth comes from being smart.
Don't tell me about stupid white men. We were smart.
"The Fighting Whities" logo needs to be bigger. Not that little dinky thing on the t-shirt. The guy's head should cover about 1/3 of the t-shirt. The lettering should span most of the width of the t-shirt. Make it bigger.
What does UIUC have to do with it? I graduated from UIUC about 25 years ago -- before all of your political correctness and other commie stupidity. |
|
Fighting Indins |
by Russ
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
15 Mar 2002
|
|
Fighting Whities is great. As a white man I'm proud of the way we tamed the savages. I'm buying a shirt immediately. |
|
Lost a sale |
by Rocky
rthein (nospam) iowatelecom.net (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
15 Mar 2002
|
|
I was going to order a Fighting Whites T-Shirt until I saw the backside of it. When I was in high school our football, basketball, etc. teams were called the Warriors and were represented by a Native American/Indian figure. This was meant in respect to them(who would have a team name we didn't respect). |
|
NOT offended |
by Phillip
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
15 Mar 2002
|
|
I like the idea, it's about time we whites has a team named for us. All the other teams are named for animals and indians! |
|
Go Fightin' Whites |
by Chuck
dynomaster (nospam) hotmail.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
15 Mar 2002
|
I am 100% behind the Fightin' Whites. It's about time we got a mascot of our own. Why, however, does our Fighting Whites homepage call us non-Indians and not non-native Americans. Is this not insensitive.
"The Fighting Whites basketball team was organized in early February (2002) by a group of Native American and non-Indian students...."
Thanks for finally paying homage to the white folk. We have enough teams named for ethinic groups. |
|
Finally........... |
by Jean
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
15 Mar 2002
|
|
a team I can call my own. Thanks. |
|
Do they really understand? |
by Wacbzz
wacbzz (nospam) mail.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
15 Mar 2002
|
Strangely enough, I don't think that these guys really get what they are doing. While trying to put the issue of how harmful (???) it is to use Native American names and characters for sports teams, they have given me, a white male, something to be proud of in these politically correct (and damning) times. When was the last time a white male received a job from a company that listed itself as an EOE, or an affirmative action employer, or even better yet, one that encourages females/minorities to apply? I have nothing against these "groups," but my position in society is waning. So, much to the chagrin of those who are putting these shirts out, I will proudly wear my "Fighting Whites" tee shirt and explain to all who ask when I wear it that I finally have an icon that I can be proud of.
Wacbzz |
|
A personal anecdote. |
by Kenneth Hodson O'Harnett
kfho (nospam) hotmail.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
15 Mar 2002
|
Hi "Fighting Whites":
I'm a UNC alum... but now live and teach Life Science (biology) in the western Pacific on/in the island of Saipan in the Northern Mariana Islands.
And yep... I'm a bona fide, certified, indubitably qualified, 100% pure ethnic "Whitie."
And as such, I am in the extreme minority here among the indiginous Chammoro people... who think quite unfavorably of "Whites" as well as of the many Asians who live and work here. The call us "Haoli's"... a name which isn't meant to be flattering the way the word is used. It equates with the infamous "N" word in the way it's often applied.
So I think it's fair and true to say that my education in the "discomforts" and nonsense of racism has been rounded out very well by the experiences and the subtle and not so subtle (blatant) discrimination "Whites" and Asians face here everyday "on the street" and in every encounter with government agencies, the police, the justice system, businesses and the bureacracies of every kind.
Being a so-called "White" (or an Asain) is a "challenge" here. So... trust me... I sympathize and appreciate the meaningful point (and the wry humor) of your team name, mascot and logo. I say, "Bravo" (nothing specifically ethnic intended) to you!
Good luck on the court and off.
RSVP: KENNETH HODSON O'HARNETT <kfho (at) hotmail.com> |
|
A SUGGESTION! |
by Kenneth Hodson O'Harnett
kfho (nospam) hotmail.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
15 Mar 2002
|
Hello again "Whites":
SUGGESTION:
No doubt you're getting a lot of commentary, interesting personal stories, support, possibly some criticism and probably some weird statements and questions, etc. In other words, you'll receive a lot of colorful messages.
DON'T DELETE YOUR MESSAGES!
There seems to be a lot of public nationwide interest in your story. So... why not save your messages, compile them into an organized collection and then perhaps you'll have the raw material for publishing a book or at least some articles about the "Whities."
Looks like good PR and good political potential, real profit potential and some real fun to me.
Anyway, I'd appreciate your letting me know if you to do this. I'm interested to see what you'll do.
RSVP: KENNETH HODSON O'HARNETT
<kfho (at) hotmail.com> |
|
Dont take ANYTHING too SERIOUS! |
by jim foster
jimnn7k (nospam) reno.rmci.net (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
15 Mar 2002
|
Hi, my mother was a teacher in the TOPINISH ,WASHINGTON area, during the depression- one of a HANDFUL of WOMAN, and a (and Im proud to say) WHITE PEOPLE to be allowed into a LONGHOUSE MEETING (as i understand it, this reserved for the Indian MALES (only)! Think what you doing is great,about time to get color blind, and be PROUD TO WEAR THIS TEE-SHIRT!! That a team calls itself a COLOR, or a CHEIF, or any other symbol, should be considered racist
(other than a racist name, and even I wouldn't consider
"the HONKIE'S" racist !! ) hey, if you cant laugh at yourself, then just WHAT CAN YOU LAUGH AT ???
but, then, look at MY PERSONAL HERO'S HISTORY ! : Chief Joseph---wish team for ANY SPORT NAMED FOR HIM, but what the HAY? his tactics STILL TAUGHT ATC WEST POINT !!!
"Let me be a free man, free to travel, free to stop, free to work, free to trade, where to choose,free to choose my own teachers ,free to follow the religion of my fathers, free to talk, think, and act for myself - and, I will obey every law, or or submit to the penalty. "
Name me a better CHEIF !!! |
|
A true story |
by Kenneth Hodson O'Harnett
kfho (nospam) hotmail.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
15 Mar 2002
|
A true story:
A friend of mine, a 60-year-old Black tennis player who is ranked No. 2 in HSB, was in living England. He applied for membership at the All-England Tennis Club (where they play Wimbledon).
The waiting list was long, but after a year or so he got a call that they wanted to interview him for membership. He left the office, all excited, and had a good interview.
During the tour of the facility, he noticed a prominent sign over the locker room door: "WHITES ONLY." It took him a minute to realize that it meant TENNIS whites (i.e., white shorts and shirts only on the courts). |
|
Hoping this doesn't backfire.. |
by Candace
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
15 Mar 2002
|
|
While I can understand the point you're trying to make, it concerns me that the persons most likely to purchase these tees in the end will be those people who promote racial issues anyhow. I don't find the mascot of the white man the least bit offensive. I'm not defined by a cartoon or any sort of imitation because I don't take myself that seriously. While mascots may have been chosen in an insensitive manner... they are meant as a compliment..to portray bravery, strength, honor, pride.. all those things you want your team, your school to be. Ignorant, maybe. Intended to insult? I doubt it. |
|
::Shakes head sadly:: |
by Kate
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
15 Mar 2002
|
It breaks my heart to see how many people here can't seem to understand the good you're trying to do here.
"The Fighting Whities" is a step in the right direction! Without the strong pull the name and motto has the impact would be lost entirely. Besides, we white people are extremely over-rated (especially by ourselves). Don't let a few closed-minded people stop you. |
|
I'm white |
by Mildred Harville
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
15 Mar 2002
|
I'm white and I'm not offended by your mascot. I think it's funny.
I think we sometimes take things too seriously, we need to loosen up and see the humor.
Go with it!
I'm glad to be able contribute to your Native American Schoolarship fund and get a T-shirt.
I think the Native Americans have gotten a raw deal since the first white man landed on American shores.
Fight congress to get back what you lost.
MHH |
|
who cares?? Have a sense of humour! |
by chase
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
15 Mar 2002
|
|
Hey, I'm white and every white person I know whose heard about this story thinks it's funny and would proudly wear a fighting-whities tshirt!! If minorities spent more energy doing constructive things for their communities instead of constantly being offended, what a world this would be!!! Let Eaton's team be called the Red, and let The Fighting Whities play, cause in the end everything will be all RIGHT!!! |
|
it's okay to be white! |
by Margaret Sandbak
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
15 Mar 2002
|
Actually I am not offended but proud that someone has finally recognized that being white is something to be proud of. For many years I have felt that I need to apologize for the color of my skin. Why can't my race be a mascot and a thing to be proud of. Your "humour" only makes me realize more that being white isn't something to be ashamed of.
sincerely, Margaret Sandbak |
|
Love the Concept! |
by Victoria Ferrelli
Bubbasmom (nospam) hotmail.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
16 Mar 2002
|
Hail the Mighty Whities! Long may they reign!
I just want to add my two-cents’ worth concerning the new mascot – and my new favorite team – the Fighting Whities. I just love that name! What’s the battle cry, “Honey, I’m home”? I wonder if any other school has the guts to change their name for the same reason. Why not have “The Battling Bradys” or “The Angry Anglos” or perhaps “The “Chargin’ Caucasians”?
Profits from this site go toward scholarship. Go get them, guys! Make lots and lots of money for the kids who are our future.
When the furor dies down regarding who’s insulting whom, let us think of the true ramifications concerning this site. It does not matter what color you are or what ethnic background you claim – the ultimate goal of this site is to make money for scholarship for native Americans and I hope they make millions! Let’s get behind this site and raise the money for these kids. Perhaps one or two of them will study economics and come to the realization that Capitalism is the great equalizer. |
|
CUSTER |
by Ken Campbell
kc313 (nospam) attbi.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
16 Mar 2002
|
|
At least most of us white folk CAN take a joke!! Where is CUSTER when you need him? |
|
The Fighting Whities are the BEST |
by Charlie Manuel
Charliemanuel (nospam) attbi.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
16 Mar 2002
|
|
I am a white anglo-saxon protestant male and think the Fighting Whities is an outstanding team name and concept. I have ordered a few of the tee shirts and am proud that someone has recognized white people for a team name. The establishment of the Fighting Whities has had the exact opposite effect from the one intended. It shows how our victim-oriented culture breeds inanity. White people all over America are buying the tee shirts, gladly, in droves. The "indians," with last names like Ryan (hello!?!) are going to be laughing all the way to the bank and the brouhaha will do nothing to further the lefty cause of taking away team names/mascots that are deemed by some as racially offensive. Talk about the law of unintended consequences. |
|
Mascot |
by A.E. Reese
aeraqua (nospam) hotmail.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
16 Mar 2002
|
|
It is so typical to think that because you don't find the mascot offensive that those who are supposed to be "honored" should not be offended as well. The "Reds" has a pejorative meaning for the "so honored" and should be changed. Why didn't those who place so much stock of the "Reds" mascot, themselves choose "Whites"? Is there no honor for them there. Why is it that those who deem themselves in the majority feel that whatever they do is right and appropriate? I thing the "Fighting Whities" have the right idea. |
|
Where is all of this headed? |
by Al
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
16 Mar 2002
|
|
If Native American mascots are offensive, how about the hundreds (thousands?) of town, city, county and state names? Is the next step to rename everything from Micanopy, FL to Oklahoma? |
|
Getting what you ask for. |
by Tim
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
16 Mar 2002
|
I believe that the route this team has chosen is having quite the unintended consequence. I believe it is hillarious and I am not offended one iota by having a white man be the mascot for a school team. This has been the argument for ages in defending the use of indians as team mascots. Take for instance, the Mississippi Rebs. This southern gentleman does not represent the average white southern male any more than the indian mascots truly depict the indian population in this country. Heck, there is a highschool in Montgomery, Alabama whose mascot is the "fighting poets". I haven't ever heard of poets clamoring to the school demanding that the name be changed because it does not properly depict the toiling writer of iambic pentameter. Let them make a white man into a mascot. Let them win many games. Let them walk in whatever shoes they wish. Perhaps in the long run, they will finally discover that the name of a mascot is inconsequential and doesn't represent any more than you allow it to.
Tim |
|
Offended ?????? |
by Bill Albright
billalbright (nospam) usa.net (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
16 Mar 2002
|
|
This is the United States of America, and there is no such thing as the right not to be offended. When ones life is so full of ones self that such a thing is offense is a sad statement of the group. GROW UP and be human. I am a white middle aged american male and think that this fighting whites slogan and naming is a great display of what is wrong with the minorities in this country. One can only feel that they are second class citizens if they think they are and act as they are. Children do and play silly games. And this is silly. Please try to offend more of us Whities. Please get a life!!!!! |
|
T-shrits |
by bill
billalbright (nospam) usa.net (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
16 Mar 2002
|
|
The Back of the t-shirt needs to be changed before I buy any. |
|
A Organized Campaign of Racism? |
by ML
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
16 Mar 2002
|
Given that vast number of comments, nearly all from the crypto-racist viewpoint of "Chief" supporters, it seems that someone is organizing a campaign to futher deride the justifiable complaints by Native Americans to stop the abuse of their image by white-dominated institutions.
It should be noted that there were no comments posted to this story from its original posting Thursday until just after 5pm Friday. Then there is a massive influx of comments, all with a nearly identical viewpoint. They might be the result of either an organized campaign by pro-"Chief" forces or simply the result of a single persistent poster. But they certainly do not represent the range of views of IMC readers or the wider community. |
|
The white guy looks too polite to fight |
by Ken Clason
krclason (nospam) omnicast.net (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
16 Mar 2002
|
I think that the attention being focused on the Fighting Whites is a positive step toward helping people of all ethnicities get past their insensitivity and/or hypersensitivity surrounding this issue. If every sports team had a name derived from racial/cultural/ethnic stereotypes, we could all have a good laugh and just get over it.
My only complaint is that the white guy on the t-shirt looks too polite. How about Joey Buttafuco as a team mascot? |
|
Be Proud No Matter Wut-wut-wut... |
by Jim Ellis
ellisjames (nospam) yahoo.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
16 Mar 2002
|
I embrace, support and understand the reason for (and concept behind) the "Fightin Whities" mascot protest. I support equal rights!
Speculation is that the team is being swamped with requests for merchandise by mostly Caucasian males for a reason. The Fighting Whities finally gave Caucasians the long desired vehicle to express the pride that they have in their heritage. Chicano, African, Hispanic, Asian, Native Americans, Gays, Females, Vegans, Left-handers, Military Veterans, Republicans and Dolly, the Cloned Sheep have all had their spotlights and fought for rights while the overly-generalized category of Caucasian men have been mostly exempted from programs of Government assistance in securing employment and educational aid for the past thirty years. The "Whities" within our collective current population have been blamed for the misdeeds and unethical policies that occurred prior to our births and have been expected to make up for and compensate for deeds/misdeeds in which we had no participation.
It is conceded that those deeds are horrible examples of our collective history and should be reprehensible to anyone, of any ethnicity, with half of a brain in today's modern society. All peoples should be lifted up and encouraged equally.
I personally have been shut out of many jobs and opportunities since the early 1970's due to preference granted to every imaginable group~ prior to my consideration. Alas, I always stayed proud and continued to strongly stand up and work- paying my own way.
My Chicano, Asian, African and Native friends who attended the same mid-town Phoenix, AZ high school have enjoyed the opportunity to make use of private, public and corporate scholarships many times in spite of their parents level of income or lack there of. Recognizing and utilizing those opportunities depended on the individuals. One Dine' (Navajo) friend was paid by his Nation for all tuition and materials plus housing while attending Arizona State University. He was granted a $500 per month assistance from a local energy producer and subsequently given a job at that Corporation. He still continued to complain about being held down by "the Man". Perhaps it was the chip on his shoulder that was so heavy! On the other hand I failed to find any financial assistance, got off my chair, found a job, paid my own expenses out of pocket and supported a family at the same time as attending the exact same classes.
This unexpected double back on the "Fighting Whities" team name concept can be positive for all parties. The added exposure to the original perceived problem and resultant protest should encourage the general public to reconsider the usage of ethnic derivative nicknames toward anything other than things which are overly serious. I encourage the animal kingdom to further the cause and take up arms fighting against future usage of their individual species in sporting monikers and group, team, tribal and national identification.
Good luck to a full support to the "Fighting Whities" in their future careers. Look for and seize opportunities as they become apparent in life. Hopefully their rebounding, on and off of the basketball courts will not be impaired by huge chips on their shoulders. Remember to be proud no matter "Wut-wut-wut"...
I will take one XL sweatshirt and one XL longsleeved T-shirt. One question remains. May have mine in Black?
Jim Ellis
Phoenix, Arizona. |
|
Offended? By what? |
by Ronny Raborn
ronnyraborn (nospam) msn.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
16 Mar 2002
|
|
I am white. I love the idea of having a white guy be the mascot of any kind of team. I have never been offended over the New England Patriots. I frankly don't understand why a native American would be offended over the Atlanta Braves, Washington Redskins, or any of the other teams with Indian mascots. I personally wish the University of North Colorado would have used an even more over-the-top white term like Fighting Honkies, Fighting Gringos, or even Fighting Whities. I think that the university is going to find out that white people are not at all going to be offended with their selection of mascot. That is not what we are about. We have a sense of humor and welcome diversity in our lives. Maybe our response to the Fighting Whites will enlighten other groups of people and show them a more positive way to react to situations. I am buying a couple of the Fighting Whites shirts, one for me and one for my wife and I am glad the proceeds are going to be used to help under-priviledged Native Americans. -Ronny |
|
NEW TEAM NAMES |
by AL BIG ELK
REGGIERIVERS (nospam) YAHOO.COM (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
16 Mar 2002
|
I heard they got two new teams now up in Greeley.
The Fightin' Fetal Alcohol Syndrome Indian Babies
The Fightin' Illegal Alien non butt wiping wet backs |
|
a neat idea backfires... |
by Pete Morrow
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
16 Mar 2002
|
Whoops...
It's my understanding that the name "Fightin' Whites" was chosen to teach white people what it's like to have your ethnic group used as a mascot. Unfortunately, this is NOT what has happened.
Like most other white people, I find the idea of "Fightin' Whites" absolutely hilarious. Most Native Americans do NOT feel the same way towards mascots like the Indians, Braves, and others.
In fact, the effects of the "Fightin' Whites" name may be the exact opposite of what the team had intended. Instead of getting offended by the "Fightin' Whites," most white people think the name is funny, and some even look at it with a sense of pride.
This will start many white people thinking that Native Americans should adopt the same attitude. "We love the Fightin' Whites," they say, "so why are you guys against the Fightin' Reds?"
Whoops... |
|
You May Be Right |
by ML
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
16 Mar 2002
|
Pete,
You may be right. When one is a marginalized minority, racial stereotypes of one's heritage are damaging and negative. When you are part of the triumphalist majority, such a stereotype of one's image can be a reinforcement of prevailing racist attitudes. This clearly seem to be the case in most of the comments made to this article.
On the other hand, the idea of any white person being proud of a racist heritage smacks of racism being denied. Unfortunately, most of the commenters above seem oblivious the fact that it IS the racist image of whites that is being parodied. Far more than the denial that racism is implicit in the image of the "Fighting Whities", it shows how deep set is the denial among many whites that racism is still alive and well, even though outright displays of racist ideas are no longer socially acceptable.
Except when it's a mascot.
The idea of "mascoting" whites as a tactic may be flawed, but it still reveals the underlying racism of many of the commenters. |
|
Those Frat Boys Must Have Left For Spring Break, Finally |
by a good guess
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
16 Mar 2002
|
The posts on this thread show an unusual concentration and unanimity, for a brief period.
One obvious conclusion about this may be that it was just one person, or a small handful, that actually generated the greatest number of the comments. Perhaps posted to somebody's list, with a note to diss the any idea that mascots like the "Chief" are anything but racially offensive?
Which was really the point that was being made by the athletes in Colorado, notwithstanding the numerous expressions of "white pride" above.
We'll never really know, but it is an interesting outcome when you think about it. |
|
I like it. |
by William Kunkle
williamkunkle (nospam) hotmail.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
16 Mar 2002
|
|
As a white man, I can honestly say that I like the idea of being a mascot. I am proud that we are finally getting equal representation in the mascot business. It's about time! |
|
I'm a Fighting Whitey |
by RC Collins
rccollins (nospam) surfsouth.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
17 Mar 2002
|
As a mostly white kind of guy I have to say, I love this idea! I honestly am in no way offended and I am probably speaking for a large majority of other whiteys too.
Go Fighting Whiteys! |
|
Stupid |
by Carl Limbacher
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
17 Mar 2002
|
|
Stupid. |
|
No offense |
by Rick Hines
wyspen (nospam) missvalley.com (unverified) |
Current rating: -1
17 Mar 2002
|
|
I'm white and I love being a mascot. The Celtics, Fighting Irish, Gaels, Yankees, etc., are all white and I don't have a problem with any of them. Political correctness is a joke. Instead of being "offended," Indians should be proud to be chosen as mascots. What's wrong with Braves, Chiefs, Redskins, et al? Nothing, that's what. It's just more liberal whining propaganda. Go Fighting Whities! |
|
'White Pride' = Racism |
by another white guy
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
17 Mar 2002
Modified: 18 Mar 2002 |
|
The shallow nature of most of the commentary here indicates that the 'white pride' expressed is nothing but racism. |
|
Fightin Whities a joke and a waste of time. |
by Mark
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
17 Mar 2002
|
I think this whole affair is a joke.
What these clowns fail to understand, is the term "Fightin Whities" does not offend anyone (in my opinion). Therefore, there is no basis for them being offended by names such as Indians, Reds, Chiefs, etc.
Now, if someone used the term F@#*$&% Indians, Reds etc., I could understand being offended, as would I if they chose the name F#*$&%(^ Whities.
I think these guys ought to get back to the business at hand, and remember why they are in school - To better themselves and their fellow-man (whomever that might be - Native Americans, Blacks, Whites etc.).
By the way, I'd be very curious to see how much $$ actually makes it from the sale of their merchandise and into the hands of students. I think the merchandise is great, but I bet less than 25% of the actual proceeds make it to their destination. People would be better off donating money to causes that directly benefit the students instead of fueling some useless marketing machine and ad campaign. |
|
cool shirt |
by blueKornboy
nezty (nospam) yahoo.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
17 Mar 2002
|
|
YES about time we turn the tables around keep it up , and keep it native later b>k>b> dine' from CoalMesa,az 16miles east of tuba city,az |
|
Fightin' whities |
by Emmett
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
17 Mar 2002
|
|
I got a chuckle out of the "fightin' whities" issue but I guess I missed the point. I found the name niether insulting or stereotypical. I believe they may have shot themselves in the foot though, as ALL of the folks I have communicated with don't seem to mind the name (I am anglo-irish-indian). We have lost the ability over the years to laugh at ourselves and have become so conscious of who's feelings we are going to hurt the we are actually more split now than any time in the past. Furthermore, I was born in America, doesn't that make me a native American? There are too many HispanicNativeAfricanChineseItalianETC Americans. We are all just Americans. Be proud of your heritage but remember who you really are. |
|
Fighting Whities |
by Stuart Hart
stuhart10 (nospam) cs.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
17 Mar 2002
|
I love it! I am a 67-year old whitie type of person, and I think what the team is doing is super. I hope they make a billion selling tee shirts & sweats. I have already ordered mine.
When will the whities of this country (and the Government) realize what has been done by our ancestors to the Native Americans? When will the wrongs (genocide, treaty-busting, etc.) be made right? Can't blame them for the way they feel.
Stuart Hart
Indianapolis, Indiana |
|
I think it's great! |
by Barb
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
17 Mar 2002
|
|
I am amused by all the outrage that is being generated at this issue of using a white man as a mascot for a change in sports. In the spirit of poking fun at the outdated mentality that continues to see nothing wrong with using another people as a mascot with offensive stereotypes embedded within that use, the real irony is that the people who still adhere to this mentality are so offended when the tables are turned. As a Native American, I find it even more ironic that I find myself cheering for the "Fighting Whites" but as it is, that is what I will do. "Good for you, Fighting Whites!" Make sure that you have more non-whites on your team though, that is even better. Maybe a couple of whites should be let in just for show. |
|
Skin Deep |
by Jim Wallace
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
17 Mar 2002
|
|
MLK once said, "let us not judge a man by the color of his skin, but by the content of his character". Why is skin color the only issue and why does the liberal agendized groups so wish to focus on that one issue? Man, be he white, red , brown , or black, should not feel honored nor feel criticized solely on his ethnicity, to do so is folly of the highest order. I wouldn't "trust" a used car salesman based on his skin color and likewise an ethnicity shouldn't feel demeaned by just a "skin color " depiction. |
|
Go Fighting Whities!! |
by Al Bondigas
GSUfan (nospam) aol.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
17 Mar 2002
|
|
I love it. You sell Fighting Whities tshirts with the proceeds going to the education of native americans. Next up, the Navajo Cannibals...We gonna eat you UP! Tshirt sale proceeds going to the education of whites. Next, the womens basketball team from Idaho known as the I da hos...Lay down, we drivin'. Proceeds going to pay for the education of the sons and daughters of pimps. Ahhh...this is great! Adelante! |
|
A much-needed laugh |
by Seth
seth553 (nospam) yahoo.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
17 Mar 2002
|
I can't understand why this would provoke feelings of either pride or resentment among my fellow whities. It does, however, conjure a hilarious image:
There he is - the battle-hardened Whitie... He fears not death or pain; better to fight and die with courage than to live in fear! For centuries his people have survived the onslaught of the genocidal Indians. Now Whitie is faced with new threats from the oppressive Blacks, the murderous Asians, and the evil Hispanics. Whitie knows no refuge and asks no quarter. He yearns only to die with his briefcase in his hand, so that he may gain entrance to Valhalla, and live for eternity among the Honky warriors of ancestry.
Oh, yes. I want a t-shirt! Go team go! |
|
Insult??? |
by Greg Barry
sgregbarry (nospam) aol.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
17 Mar 2002
|
I'm not insulted. Was that the intent? I've never understood the idea of being insulted by what you are. No matter what you are ethnically, nobody can MAKE you feel one way or another about it, unless you ALLOW them to. It's your decision. I'm a white male, so was never teased about ethnicity, but kids in school are eternally cruel, so they found something to tease me about. Of course, all of us endured some sort of teasing, unwanted nicknames, etc. Goes with being human. Change human nature and it may go away, otherwise get over it. Allow someone else to determine the way you feel about being Caucasian, Asian, African, Indian, Russian, Polish, Hispanic, Middle Eastern, German, Pacific Islander, Yankee, Rebel, Jewish, any combination of the above, or ________(you fill in blank), and you allow them to determine how happy and profitable you are in life. It's ALL up to YOU.
Lest anyone become confused, not only am I white (Caucasian for the PC crowd), I am also very conservative. What I have written is the very root of conservatism - self determination. We conservatives have endured quite a lot of discrimination lately, but continue to be the backbone of this country and way of life. WE are the business owners of America, fueling the strongest economy the world has ever seen, precisely because we don't let others make us feel one way or another about ourselves. We chose to determine our own feelings about ourselves and our ABILITIES. Every person has abilities, you just gotta' quit crying and use 'em. |
|
Does anyone here get it? |
by Matt Shields
MChirchill (nospam) cs.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
17 Mar 2002
|
Wow. It blows my mind how almost everyone who has commented here totally doesn't get it about native sports mascots....
It doesn't matter if you (or the school, or some other white dude, or whoever) think it's offensive or not. Duh. If you name something after a group of people, and they don't want you to have named it after them, you should change the freaking name. That's not called "Political Correctness" it's called "Not being an A** Hole."
If someone is offended by something you say, and you don't understand why, it is probably you who doesn't get it. People don't get offended for no reason. People a different. Different people are offended by different things. That doesn't mean it's ok to be a d*ck to them just cause you wouldn't be offended by what you're saying/doing.
I'm really sick of this whole anti-PC backlash crap. The PC movement, such as it was, is thankfully dead and burried. But there are still all these rednecks out there who think they can go around treating people how ever they want and then if anyone complains, they can brush them off as just being "PC". That's a bunch of crap.
It's not about anyone changing their way of life, or anything like that. It's just about people seeing if they can get through their day without being needlessly mean to other people.
It's not that complicated.
- Matt Shields
A Pretty Conservative White Guy in Oregon. |
|
Long live the Berlin Jews! |
by John Capurnicus
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
17 Mar 2002
|
I think naming a team after a race that was annihilated is completely counterintuitive. Germany should rename some of their soccer teams after their genocides to honor the fallen races.
Berlin Jews
Frankfurt Gypsies |
|
TO GOOD |
by Todd Thomas
greatyedi (nospam) yahoo.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
17 Mar 2002
|
|
I think the mascot is a great idea. Although I don't believe the team actually thought that white people were going to like it. It may have back fired but still great idea. The next thing the NAACP will be in on it because it's to good! |
|
Mascot costume |
by emt277
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
17 Mar 2002
|
I like the new name, and at least your mascot won't have to dress up in a huge big headed hot costume! It should
not be a problem to find someone that looks like your image.
Thanks
emt277 |
|
fighting whites mascot |
by kathleen kinzie
kathleenkinzie (nospam) hotmail.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
17 Mar 2002
|
Good work guys!
Your mascot is as tasteful as a stereotype can be. I would
be proud to wear one of your t-shirts and hope your team does well. This reminds me of the remark by a high school student who was defending their choice of an Indian mascot which went something like, "Well, we could have just as easily chosen another dumb animal." Duh.
Go get 'em Whites!!
Kathleen |
|
Does The Shoe Fit? |
by Deborah
numupihi (nospam) hotmail.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
|
Too funny! |
|
Thanks |
by Jeffrey Seaman
Seaman.Jeffrey! (nospam) broadban.att.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
I feel as though this is the greatest article I have ever read. Please send me any additional info to my email above.
Thanks!!! |
|
Honored, not Insulted |
by Micki Cunningham
Micki_Cunningham (nospam) ao.uscourts.gov (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
|
I am not offended that a White Man has been selected as this team's mascot. I am honored! I think it is wonderful! The Native Americans should not be offended either when a school selects a mascot pertaining to the Native Americans. People want to have pride in their schools and their school's mascot. It is not an insult or a slur, it is all about pride and being proud of your school and what it stands for. Native Americans should be proud every single time a Native American is chosen to be a mascot or a school names their team after a Native American. I think it is incredible that the Native Americans CHOOSE to be insulted over this! |
|
Ordering the T-Shirt |
by Micki Cunningham
Micki_Cunningham (nospam) ao.uscourts.gov (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
|
Can I order a T-Shirt without the printing on the back? I won't order a T-shirt, if the back is printed with the current message. |
|
Where Can I get a Tee-shirt? |
by Kim
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
Modified: 09:28:02 AM |
Please post where we can order tee shirts.
This is great.
Thanks!
SC |
|
Go Whities!!! |
by Brad Greenstreet
Brad_Greenstreet (nospam) tiginsurance.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
My name is Brad. Now I feel fully represented. I felt like I was losing my identity and then I bought a Fightin' Whites t-shirt and my whole life has changed. Thankyou UNC, and especially to you Fightin' Whites!
Now go out and kick some #$$!!
I bought stuff at your store this morning and sent your
email to friends.
Good luck with the 'project', if it gets people irritated
and upset then they'll start thinking. |
|
Fighting Whities |
by Marc
cheaperthandirt (nospam) aol.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
I think the Fighting Whities is very funny. But, to tell the truth, I really do not see what all the fuss is about. For example, I know a number of cowboys in Texas, but no one is offended by the Dallas football team. I never hear the Catholic church complain about the San Diego baseball team, the California baseball team, or the New Orleans football team. No one I know north of the Mason-Dixon line is offended by the New York Yankees. Moreover, I have never hear one peep from any Viking, Celtic, Irish, Rebel, Packer, Sooner, Cornhusker, Patriot, or anyone else glorified by a sports team--only the "Native American."
Can you imagine if the new Houston NFL franchise decided to name themselves the Houston Whities, instead of the Texans. Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson would be on the next plane to Houston to complain how offensive the "Whities" would be to the black population--just the opposite of what you are concerned about.
I am white. I am not offended by the Whities. Personally, I am flattered to have a team named after me. I am only disappointed that you will likely make a great deal of money from the sale of logo shirts. |
|
somthing funny |
by tiann and brenda
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
|
we think your doing a great job and the money is going to a great cause just wanted to let you know our opinion and do not let anything get to you from tiann and brenda |
|
That was like therapy! |
by Brad Greenstreet
Brad_Greenstreet (nospam) tiginsurance.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
My first post felt good, so here's another. Just saying the
phrase "GO WHITIES", OOOHHH YEAH, "GO WHITIES", KICK SOME
#$$ WHITIES!!!
Wow that feels good. Now I can say that without being racist. I want to go to downtown Dallas to the nearest street corner and shout it, ...well maybe that's not a good idea.
Of course I'll be wearing my Fightin' Whites t-shirt when
I do it. Now we can all use the above phrases, without the PC police coming down on us.
Maybe making fun of ourselves is a way to realize how much
we're alike?
Hey guys when will you have bumperstickers??!!
Go Native Pride,...home of the FIGHTIN' WHITES!!!!!!!!! |
|
Insulted? Why? |
by Larry
jazzbassjukin (nospam) hotmail.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
Well I'm seeing the mascot issue from the other side now, and I'm just not a bit insulted. Try harder.
I find it interesting that minorities, in their fight against racism and bigotry, have shown themselves to be racist and bigoted as well. Ah, the pot calling the kettle black I suppose.
BTW, the so called "Civil War" was not a war against slavery- it was in fact a war of economics. The slavery issue was used as an attempt to justify the northern states aggression against the south. Try reading "The South Was Right" by James and Walter Kennedy. You might find it enlightening. Or just send me lots of hate mail and reinforce your narrow-minded racist and bigoted views with more one-sided NAACP propoganda. |
|
I will order my shirt soon |
by Lester Warren
tarzan1965 (nospam) hotmail.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
Dear Sir(s)
I do not find the mascot of the Fighting Whities offensive. I, for one, laugh at the humorous, no matter what creed, color, race, or gender it is aimed at.
That is what has been lost in our society, the ability to laugh at ones self.
I wish your team the best and I fully support them, no matter what the mascot is.
Best Wishes,
Lester Warren
Burlington, NC |
|
Great name stupid subject |
by Rob Knoll
rob (nospam) crmmortgage.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
|
What a waste of time over such a stupid issue. Mascotts are mascotts, who the heck cares. Get a real life. Indians were savages, they are lucky America won't let the truth out anymore. Get a real issue, like how Liberal, communist, Democrats are ruining this great country. This PC nonsense is just that NONSENSE. |
|
Everythang IS all white |
by Kurt
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
As a white man, I will say that in no way does this offend me. You could call the team the "Fightin' Crackers" and it would make no difference.
This is simply because I refuse to give another human being (especially one I don't know) that much power over me. Call it a mark of my race if you want, but i can think of no negative slang work referring to 'white' people that I find offensive. On the other hand, that I can utter a single word, regardless of the context, and figuratively bring the house down....now THAT'S power. |
|
Who cares???? |
by Bob Pestka
rppestka (nospam) ticon.net (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
I cannot believe anyone would think that "The Fightin' Whities" is offensive. The thing that many minority ethnic/gender groups don't understand is that there is no unified white race. You're not going to be able to offend caucasions, as a group, because we don't think of ourselves as a group as many people of like gender/ethnicity do.
While I fully concur that outrageous sterotypical caricatures can be or are offensive to many people, I don't think making fun of white folks as a group is going to work. Most of the people I've talked to just laughed when they heard the story & wanted to know where to a shirt. I'm sure that was not the intended goal.
My suggestion is to "hit 'em where it hurts", in the pocketbook. If you don't like the stand a group of people takes, don't patronize any of there businesses. Sell as many T-shirts as you can & use the money to start your own shops & undercut the other guy's prices.
The one color most folks of any group seem to understand is green!! |
|
hilarious |
by Tim
Tometfan (nospam) aol.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
|
I'm white..and I think thats hilarious, and I think I might by one of their t-shirts...people need to take themselves less seriously, what better way to do this but through humor. Now all the white folks need is an official month so that's why we should declare MARCH IS WHITE AMERICAN MALE MONTH...E! |
|
All White! |
by John Arizaga
arizaga (nospam) comcast.net (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
I think it's a great idea that you're doing this. Looking at the mascot and thinking of the ethicity of the team is hilarious to me. I have always thought that people should not take themselves so seriously these days. The scholarship fund is also a great idea. Really cool.
I'll be buying my shirt. Good luck dudes! |
|
Diversity strikes with Solomon's help |
by M.J.Custard
mcustard (nospam) wildwood.edu (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
How can I get a T'shirt , I support what is trying to be said.
But there is more important issues but as we see it diversity
is in the house.
Please contact me through e-mail asap.
Again thanks. |
|
It should be Whities, not Whites |
by Bubbba
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
I like the whole concept, except that the term "Whities" should be used instead of "Whites". "Whites" sounds like a bunch of Russian anti-communists (hey, maybe that is appropriate?). "Whities" (plural of "Whitey") is more of derogatory slang nickname that is appropriate for a mascot or team name.
But now that you have a team name, you'll need a mascot. Perhaps someone in a 3-piece suit with a briefcase, the slick-back hair helment and thick glasses as on the picture. I think it would work well.
And, it would solve the whole "offensive mascot" controversy. Once every racial group has been equally offended, no one can complain they have been singled out. Hey, I have a new mascot idea for San Francisco - think they'll buy it?
No one complains about the "Fighting Irish" mascot or team nickname, or that mascot and team name play to the most derogatory aspects of anti-Irish Prejudice (drunken sots who constantly fistfight). The mascot also is ridiculously short and has exaggerated ethnic features. Of course, there are many Irish at Notre Dame, so maybe they picked the mascot and like it. Most "indian" themed teams were not founded by Indians, however.
The Washington "Redskins" name of course has always been controversial. Someone suggested (as a joke) a few years back renaming it the Washington N*ggers. When you put it that way, you can clearly understand how these ethnic stereotypes could be offensive. As a mental exercise, envision the mascot of such a team. Do you get it yet? OK.
Most folks didn't understand that the guy was trying to illustrate how one racial stereotype could be considered by most as clearly offensive (i.e., black stereotypes) while others (Indian stereotypes) are considered non-offensive. The "Whities" team name is a better way to skewer these stereotypes, as people couldn't see past the "N-word" to understand the point being made..
While we're on the subject, maybe we need a better name for "Indian". Indians are clearly not from India, no matter what Columbus though as he slaughtered them. However, as a "Native" born American, I don't like the term "Native American" as it implies that I am an alien. Similarly, "Indiginous Peoples" is also inaccurate, as no one alive today was "indiginous". We all came here from somewhere else, whether by ship or by land bridge. And each successive "invader" slaughtered the previous. Check out what happened to the Anasazi people in Arizona, for example.
MAYBE what we all need to do is stop defining ourselves based upon who we are descended from and start defining ourselves based upon who we ARE. "Culture" can be a trap. Once we are over that hurdle, real progress can be made. That, and the day comes that everyone interbreeds to the point where we are all a mixed shade of grey. FWIW. |
|
proud |
by Jeff MacKenna
flcn125 (nospam) aol.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
|
This is a Great idea. Where can I buy a t-shirt to show my Whitie pride? Can we have white pride month? How about a white pride march for all the white males who have been blamed for most of society's problems in the last 20 years. |
|
a white reaction |
by k carleton
kerryc315 (nospam) aol.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
I love it... Finally our race is being honored by being a mascot... i am sending in a check to buy shirts ! Yes Plural!
I beleive the reason you changed the mascot is ridiculous, but am proud you chose a nobel race and ethic group to celebrate and honor as your mascot.
Go Whites , Go Whites...
I love it, I love it, I love it! it is bringing tears of joy to my eyes... thanks!
- Kerry |
|
The Fighting Whities |
by Dave Kapica
DKapica (nospam) aol.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
|
I am a 40 year old white male. I am NOT offended in the least little bit by this. I think that this will blow up in UNC's face and have the reverse affect. I plan to order a "Fighting Whities" shirt because I'm proud to be white and I want others to know that too! I support Eaton and their mascot. |
|
Fighting Whites |
by Robert A. Pyzik
redwings1951 (nospam) yahoo.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
I am a white, American male and take no offense whatsoever in the name the "Fighting Whites" or the "Fighting Whities".
Actually, I find it humerous. If you can't poke a little fun at yourself, your life must be miserable. Thanks for the laugh and I hope you have great success with this.GO FIGHTING WHITES!!!!!! |
|
I finally knowhow the other shoe feels |
by S. King
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
|
At 33, I have grown up hearing about the team name/mascot debate. Throughout this debate, I always disagreed with the sentiment that Indian names and mascots are somehow destructive to the Native American Heritage. Finally though, I now know how it feels and it has forced me to examine my views. Today, I sit before my computer and after much circumspect...I still believe there isn't a thing wrong with the naming of sporting teams or mascots after Native Americans, European Americans or another group. In fact, if memory serves, the Fighting Whites may be the first team name selected that I find humorous, but if digging down deep during the last two minutes of a game and conjuring up an image of some white, dumpy middle age guy helps to motivate a team in achieving a win, then they should Go For It! Go Whites Go! |
|
Complete the circle... |
by LStopp
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
OK, after reading all of these comments, I have a few things to say. First of all, the one who said something about what the creator of the chiefs meant.....what do YOU mean? Are you talking about the creators of the Chief's football team?? If so, you should investigate enough to know that the team was named for it's owner, a white business man in a suit and tie, who was called "Chief" because he was the boss.....it had nothing to do with Indian chiefs, tomahawks, chop chop hand signals, and the likes.
Actually, the shirt is probably not going to get through the yoneg's thick skulls. THEY don't see anything wrong with being compared to a stereotypical white guy nice and clean cut in a suit. That's what they aspire to be. BUT, if they would realize that Chief is a religious and spiritual position, they might understand if we named a team let's say, the CARDINALS, and had him wear a funny little hat and robe, and the spectatos' genuflected when they scored, and they sold rosaries for a dollar in the aisles. They don't understand that the term REDSKIN is defined by many dictionaries as a term synonymous to the *N* word. They also don't understand that, even though they preach about non-violence and family values, using the tomahawks, chop signals, etc. portrays Indians as violent. And that the eagle feather is sacred to us....not something to make fun of with chicken feathers painted neon colors.
I think for this to really sink in, we need to complete it with trailer-trash cheerleaders. This whole thing goes to show you the difference between white and Indian thinking. Everything I can think of that would be stereotypical white and would make fun of them or desecrate their morals, beliefs and religion, is something THEY would be PROUD of! I mean, how can you ever get it through to people who would be proud to be HOMER SIMPSON????? |
|
Way to go! |
by Lettie Walker
lah572001 (nospam) yahoo.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
I want to thank Charles Cuny for taking this stand, as well as everyone else who is doing this together. We are so tired of the ongoing racist celebration in popular sports. . although it's still not the same for them.. .without the history of being the targets of genocide, the many many experiences of actual slaughter, abuse, annihilation of their lifestyle, culture, and generations, they may not understand what it's like to be disenfranchised, etc. on their own land, and then being held up as a charicature.
I'm a grandmother and tired of fighting, (although I am still an activist working on many issue). . .it's good that you've taken on this fight. . we'll keep you in our prayers and hope that you don't become targeted for further acts of racism. Stay strong!
Lettie |
|
Great Go'in!!! |
by Sahoni Redbird
redbird (nospam) aloha.net (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
What a GREAT idea!!! And I really think it's gracious of you NOT to have an awful caricature of the logo you have
chosen - better than most NDN mascots - that's for sure.
Hope you will do more - with different designs. Best to you and thanks for doing this. Aloha. |
|
I want to but a tee shirt |
by carol
ctn1 (nospam) bellsouth.net (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
|
Please let me know how I can buy a shirt |
|
funny |
by Brock LaReau
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
|
so, what does it mean if, as a white guy, this name doesn't offend me at all? |
|
Proud to be a Fightin Whitey |
by Rob Brixey
robbrixey (nospam) mchsi.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
I am glad to see that people have "lightened" up a bit.
I am ethnically Irish - that would be a Fighting Irish, or an Orangeman, or a Fightin' Whitey.
I have noted that The Mascot Ethnic Sensitive do NOT critique those mascots who exploit white folks. And you know what?
WE DON'T, EITHER.
Isn't it funny that people who extoll the virtues of DIVERSITY really want people to think the same, act the same, and talk the same line of shit?
Its not about DIVERSITY, is it?
Its about CONFORMITY to a standard of Political Correctness.
Who squandered their savings on your education?
You're supposed to be COLLEGE students.
Get a dictionary.
THINK about it... |
|
Very proud of UNC Native American Students! |
by Linda Turnbull-Lewis
naitca (nospam) fullnet.net (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
My response to Brian Ojanpa's article about the Sports Illustrated poll re: mascots and sports team name issues voices what I feel about the issue and points brought up in the article here.
Mr. Ojanpa:
Did anyone "poll" Black Americans when they said the "N" word was offensive?
My comment regarding the SI poll is this.... if 25 percent of the people polled object to the use of mascots and disrespectful use of same, then this an extremely strong and potent statement. It is not up to those offending to determine for those offended the degree of offense. There are particular Indian Nations who find the use of the term "red skin" highly offensive because it was their ancestors whose lives were taken when a $50 bounty was offered by the U.S. Government for the scalps (that they called "red skins") of all Indian males 12 years and older. This was in the late 1800s... not that far removed from tribal memories.
If 25% of a student body was offended by a perceived racial insult, most likely this would have a great impact on school policy. We have observed that if you are Black, Hispanic, or Asian people are quick to respond to any perceived racial offense, however, Native Americans who make up a small percentage of minorities in the "mainstream" apparently get ignored. Did anyone "poll" Black Americans when they said the "N" word was offensive? Polls taken from the more acculturated tribes and Native American Indian students from mainstream universities on this issue is offensive in and of itself. Tribal histories and tribal memories are quickly being absorbed into mainstream America. The day that Native Americans are no longer offended by disrespectful characterizations of their race.... their nations and cultures will be extinct. As my Kiowa friends say, the day the drum stop beating, the Kiowa will no longer exist.
The only thing that keeps our 547 different Native American sovereign nations in tact today is their unique cultural identities, histories, and their government to government agreements with the U.S. government. The U.S. government's goal to mainstream tribal nations will have been reached when Native Americans no longer carry tribal memories and tribal histories are unknown.
Susan Harjo and many like her have carried the torch for years, as have such learned scholars as Dr. Rennard Strickland, Tim Giago, and dozens of other very well known and respected Native American leaders and scholars. Their very civilized approach to delivering the message has apparently been ignored by a mainsteam press who knows nothing about tribal nations, their rich history and contributions to the world today. You sure won't learn this part of American history in mainstream schools. Apparently it would take race wars, numbers of protestors enmasse and civil unrest to let mainstream know that racial slurs hurt. At least Martin Luther King didn't give up, nor did Nelson Mandella and hundreds like them.
As a human being, if "anyone" told me they were offended by my use of a racially offensive name, slogan, or logo, I would apologize and discontinue the offense. This seems such a simple issue to me... if it hurts people, then simply stop hurting them. Apparently we have taken to "polling" to decide to stop hurting others. What a world.
Linda Turnbull-Lewis
Cherokee Citizen
P.O. Box 1767
Tahlequah, OK 74465
918-458-9322
Below is the Brian Ojanpa article re: Sports Illustrated Poll....
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Poll drops bomb on Indian nickname, mascot issue
By Brian Ojanpa
Free Press Staff Writer
The 30-year effort to rid the sports landscape of Native American nicknames and mascots has never been easy. Now, the task has been made even more difficult by the unlikeliest group of all - Native Americans. A nationwide poll that surveyed a cross-section of sports fans and
Indians in general has revealed a startling finding:
The majority of American Indians polled have no problem with the use of Indian nicknames and symbols and said professional teams shouldn't stop using them.
Further, most Native Americans surveyed didn't even object to the Washington football team's name, Redskins, a moniker many regard as a racial slur.
The poll, commissioned by Sports Illustrated and published in its March 4 edition, was conducted by the Peter Harris Research Group, which interviewed Native Americans living on and off reservations as well as non-Indian fans. Responses were weighted according to U.S. census
figures for age, race and gender.
In other words, this wasn't some high school class project, nor one of those surveys deliberately skewed to achieve desired findings. Attacking the messengers - and their methodology - would be futile for anti-nickname activists, who have been dealt a large blow.
For years, the campaign against Indian nicknames and mascots has presumed their usages offend Indians. But according to the poll, the consensus falls in the opposite direction:
83 percent of Indians, and 79 percent of fans, said pro teams should not stop using Indian nicknames, mascots and symbols. 75 percent of Indians, and 88 percent of fans, said use of the names and symbols does not contribute to discrimination against Indians. Asked if high school and college teams should stop using Indian
nicknames, 81 percent of Native American respondents said no.
If anything, the poll reveals the vast disconnect on this issue between Native American activists and the general Native American population. It would seem that anti-nickname forces now face an untenable predicament:
Mock the research or mock Native Americans for their perceived unenlightenment.
The latter has already happened, with Native American activist Suzan Harjo dismissing the majority's opinion by telling the magazine, ``There are happy campers on every plantation.''
This, of course, is stereotyping in itself - the implication that most Native Americans simply don't possess the self-esteem and smarts
required to be insulted by teams naming themselves after indigenous
peoples.
Then again, infighting on this complex issue is nothing new. Though more than 600 schools and minor league teams since 1969 have dropped Indian nicknames some deem offensive, they not only persist but, in some
instances, have been sanctioned by Native Americans.
Florida State University uses the name Seminoles for its teams with the approval of the Seminole nation. And several years ago, the University of Utah offered to drop the nickname Running Utes, and its eagle-feathers-and-drum logo, if the tribe found them objectionable. It
did not, provided that they be used in a positive manner.
That last point goes the crux of the issue. Names and symbols per se are
usually not the problem. It's the attendant behavior by fans, and the
cartoonish antics of mascots, that Native Americans have rightly found
objectionable.
But even on that point, there is anything but mass disapproval.
Asked what they thought of the tomahawk chop arm motion performed by
fans at Atlanta Braves games, 23 percent of Indians polled found it
objectionable, while 48 percent didn't care and 28 percent said they
liked it.
|
|
Fighting Whites |
by Suzie Kelly
gregsuzie (nospam) centurytel.net (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
Hello,
I have never understood what the big deal is about the mascots. Where I live, our High school mascot is the Braves. To those of us who live hear the name is meant as symbol of strength and honor. It was never meant to be derogatory. I am glad and feel honored that finally, the white man has a mascot named after him! It does not offend me in the least. I think that everyone needs to quit being so ultra sensitive.
Take care and God Bless America! |
|
They still don't get it. |
by Bubba
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
OK, let me spell it out for you.
Suppose the Washington Redskins decide to change their name to the "Washington Negros" (or other "N" word) Given the population demographics of Washington, it would make as much sense as Notre Dame being the "Fighting Irish". There are far more blacks in DC than Indians.
Now, Suppose their their mascot was a shucking and jiving blackface fellow who said things like "Yassuh!" and "Mammy!" and sang "Dixie" during the intermission. Or maybe a slave in chains? Or how about a pimp or drug dealer?
Would you consider any of these offensive? Of course you would! You wouldn't even think about it twice, no matter what your race is.
Now replace it with a "Redskin" or a "Chief Wahoo" with a buckteeth grin and exaggerated ethnic features - and throw in some white guy dancing around in a "redskin" coustume.
What's the difference?
Well the difference is, black folks wouldn't let the former happen. "Indians" don't have enough political clout to prevent the latter.
Anybody get it yet?
Syracuse University got rid of their "Saltine Warrior" years ago and replaced it with a dorky "Orange". While many lamented the passing of the Saltine Warrier, the nearby Onondaga Indians did not. The "Warrior" was usually a white student in Redface (no different from Blackface, really) pantomiming crude Indian-like behavior for the amusement of the audience. Wooo-wooo wooo-wooo, you know, all Indians do that!
Blackface died with Vaudville. When will Redface? Ug! Me wantum heap-big T-shirt! You swap-em for sqaw! That sort of thing is as demeaning as the Vaudville routines where white people would play black folks as buffoons and idiots. Why has one died nearly a century ago and yet the other persists?
This is not to say that Native American imagery can never be tastefully used. Native Americans ("Indians" or whatever) have been featured on almost every form of US currency at one time or another. It is a common theme, perhaps perversely "honoring" the ancestral people who lived here (note, as opposed to their present-day decendants). But the characters features have been dignified representations, not cartoonish buffoons.
FWIW! |
|
Rush Limbaugh supports Fightin' Whities |
by Mort Shelby
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
18 Mar 2002
|
For all the wrong reasons, of course. He's also posted this web address on his website so that his dittoheads will post to it and try to sabotage the humor of this concept by thanking the team for honoring white people, pretending to misunderstand the concept.
Oh, they understand it, alright. That's why they've arrived at this site to post their comments. Because they're threatened by it. They're frightened by it.
I oughtta know. I'm a white guy myself. I've lived among these savages for years.
Keep chipping away at the steretypes, Fightin' Whities! You guys have basketballs of brass! |
|
You people are the ones that don't get it! |
by Suzie Kelly
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
19 Mar 2002
Modified: 05:19:17 PM |
Believe it or not, I did not get the address from Rush Limbaugh and I did not come on this web site ready to call people names, (Ditto Head). It just goes to show you what you people are really about. Anger and hatred! There is nothing deragatory about the Braves, Warriors, ect. People name there teams after something that stands for strength and toughness. If everyone would just quit all the whinning all the time, we would all get along better. I guess people that have nothing better to do will always complain about something. Please let's all try to get along and refrain from the name calling!
May God Bless America! |
|
This is great!!!!! |
by Lauri
lcastel70 (nospam) aol.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
19 Mar 2002
|
|
How cool is it to be able to wear a shirt that proclaims that is is OK to be white?? "LATINO PRIDE" and "BLACK PRIDE" etc. have always been acceptable in the eyes of todays society but to wear ANYTHING that proclaims "WHITE PRIDE" is always seen as racist. Thank you for making a shirt that honors the white Americans. I am definitely going to buy a shirt and proudly wear it here in sunny South Florida!! (Even though down here I will have to duck some stray bullets heading my way because of the shirt!!) |
|
What's the big deal? |
by Dave Phoenix
dphoenix1020 (nospam) charter.net (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
19 Mar 2002
|
|
Yes, the team's name may be offensive to some. Yes, it pokes fun at the "Reds" team (note: on the other hand Cincinatti Reds, I don't believe, have any native american connotation, and Russian communists were referred to as "Reds"), but our country allows freedom of speech, period. |
|
Happy to have White Mascott |
by Todd Parks
toddparks (nospam) nraonline.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
19 Mar 2002
|
|
Its about time. The Native Americans have been honored along with certian trades associated with the areas they represent. I'm white and very happy to see this. Hope that many White People buy and wear t-shirt proudly. |
|
Not the first "white" mascot |
by Pete Anderson
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
19 Mar 2002
Modified: 05:14:28 PM |
I have been complaining for years about team names and mascots that marginalize white people. Notre Dame's "Fighting Irish" is a terrible stereotype that suggests all Irish people are prone to brawling. Minnesota "Vikings" conjures up images of brawny Swedes rampaging through Europe razing villages and raping women. I am sure all Scandanavians are humiliated to be associated with that image. Names like "Minutemen" and "Patriots" make a mockery of the people who fought and died to win freedom for ALL Americans regardless of skin color. In fact, I think all schools and sports teams should be forced to drop ANY mascot or team name that could in any way be construed to offend ANYONE. No colors should be used since white, red, yellow, black and brown are sure to offend. No racial stereotypes or careers should be used (Packers, Brewers, Pirates). No animal names should be used since we should respect vegetarians and conservationists. Actually, maybe we should drop sports teams altogether. After all, somebody has to lose whenever two teams compete. That probably hurts their feelings.
PS - do any of you understand the word "sarcasm"? |
|
Mascots are Not demeaning |
by Jeff Nichols
pistola82 (nospam) hotmail.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
19 Mar 2002
|
Mascots are not meant to be demeaning, they are used more for morale building. If someone was not proud of a mascot, then why use it? Does someone use a mascot and not show support toward it? I think it is rediculous that people would argue over something like this.
I truely think that people have to get a life and quit moaning about who is their mascot. If someone made me their mascot, I would be proud and honored.
Seems to me that in these days of instant awards to people who sue for nothing more than being raised wrong or listen to money hungry lawyers.
I think that now more than ever we need more things to be proud of in our country.
So get a life and quit whining about stupid things, worry more about our troops and our people dying and stick together. |
|
Fighting Illini Country |
by Mimi Rivera
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
19 Mar 2002
|
Bravo! Pretty funny idea. At least it gets people talking. I doubt that the whites will be offended. As they are the superior race. All will take it as a joke and say, "so what is the big deal with indian mascotts?". I am happy to support the scholarship fund with my purchase of the t-shirt. Just the fact that you are getting money for the scholarship is a big deal. I was thinking it might have been a little more offensive if the name was the fighting honkey's. I like that the man looks an awful lot like Ronald Reagan. This has not been mentioned by any of the media. How can they not see it? I would like to see a black t-shirt with the red logo changed to white.
Good Luck!! I will be looking at your stats in the future.
Caribbean Taino Indian,
Mi Mi |
|
raphael Szykowski is right |
by alex
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
19 Mar 2002
|
you said it raphael. from most of the posts on this page, maybe the scholarship money should go to dumb white men.
let us not forget the class issue. the "color line" is very important, but class also plays a role.
as for the effectiveness of this approach on enlightening people, i don't know. maybe only mass murder, subjugation, slavery, and destruction of culture for hundreds of years will make folks really understand.
peace |
|
No wonder the indians lost the west |
by bill dainoski
slickdain (nospam) excite2.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
19 Mar 2002
|
No wonder the indians lost the west! If they thought that whit people would be upset by the eir team tee shirts ... boy were they wrong!
Or maybe this is an ambush!!! Look at their website. They are selling team tee shirts. |
|
Limbaugh's Website? |
by gehrig
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
19 Mar 2002
Modified: 03:39:58 PM |
Mort Shelby: "He's also posted this web address on his website so that his dittoheads will post to it and try to sabotage the humor of this concept by thanking the team for honoring white people, pretending to misunderstand the concept."
Could someone please confirm whether or not this address has been posted on Limbaugh's site? That would certainly explain the influx of a bloc of one-time, monolithic-opinion posters from around the country.
And if so, hey, dittoheads -- stick around; you might learn some of the stuff Rush doesn't want to tell you.
@%< |
|
Proves a point |
by Realist
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
19 Mar 2002
|
|
The real lesson in all this is American Indians have their on racists and bigots too. Now when they point fingers at other groups, those groups can turn the tables on them. What started out as a cute prank has opened the door to reality. But I seriously doubt "left wingers" will get it since they live in their own little PC world... |
|
Why be offended? |
by Richard Centner
txcentnerr (nospam) prodigy.net (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
19 Mar 2002
|
Howdy from Arlington, TX!
My wife is a member of the Chickasaw tribe of First Americans, as are my son and daughter. All three are quite proud of their heritage and, unlike most activists, well educated in the history of their tribe -- such as their march along the Trail of Tears with the other Five Civilized Tribes. That march may have something to do with the decision of most members of those tribes to fight on the Confederate side during the Civil War.
My wife won't let me refer to her as a Native American in the politically correct sense. In a real sense, I'm a Native American since I was born here, as is everyone who isn't a Naturalized American. The reason most Whites are unlikely to be offended by Fightin' Whities is that we aren't professional victims. When I was in my teens, I was taunted for my religion, one team even spit on. Today, it would probably bring a lawsuit. Back in high school, my Dad just told me --Sticks and stones may break my bones, but names will never hurt me.
If someone commits a crime against a Native American Indian, I'll enthusiastically support fines and/or imprisonment for the offender. But, being offended by, and protesting against, namecalling simply gives names much more power than they should have. |
|
Go Darkies! |
by Cherokee Kid
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
19 Mar 2002
|
I think it's a bit sad, but not surprisng that so many white people don't get it. The problem is that "Redskins", "Indians", and "Cheifs" are all English names imposed on the members of indiginous tribes by Europeans and Euro-Americans. They have been used in a perjorative sense for far longer than they have been used to "uplift" and "honor".
If these words were truly able to suddenly adopt new manings in our collecitve mindset, then we should also be able to have teams like the Altanta "Tarbabies", the San Francisco "Chinks", the New York "WOPs", or the Charleston "Darkies". Who wants to take a stand for those types of mascots? Who wouldn't be offended by a team mascot protrayed as an dark skinned African wearing ratty overalls and a straw hat - big red lips and gleaming white teeth as he waves to the crowd and says "Yassuh, we gon whup dem Detro' Layuns reaw good come dis Sunday"
Anyone... anyone...?
I thought not.
Stereotypes take away the rights of American Indains (and others) to define themselves. A lot of people have been suggesting that steretypeos only hurt if minorities internalize them - that if minorites don't define themselves that way, then all will be well. I appreciate the sentiment and I wish it were true, but take a hard look at the scientific research on stereotypes. Take a look at the research of prominent psychologists like Jack Dovidio, Samuel Gaernter, Claude Steel, John McConahay, and Anthony Greenwald. It's not a pretty picture.
When Blacks, Hispanics, Indians, etc. leave the confines of their own homes and communites, they have to prove to their supervisors, teachers, and the like (usually white) that they are NOT stupid, lazy, drunk, incompetent. Anything that can be construed as confirming these stereotypes is what people will attend to. The individual minorty can refuse to define himself by the stereotype, but as long as the guy doing the hiring, grading, or evaluating believes the sterotype, it doesn't matter.
That's not to say that reverse discrimination doesn't occur or that white people never suffer because of negative stereotypes about whites. I'm sure everyone knows at least one example of this and it's just as wrong. But white people are in a position to weather the effects of stereotypes in ways that minorities cannot. No one follows white people around the store waiting to catch them steal something. |
|
I Think It's Great! |
by Connie Taylor
ctaylor (nospam) 1000trails.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
19 Mar 2002
|
I personally am not offended by any team using symbolism of white people or should I say 'whities' or 'crackers' or 'cream puffs' or 'white skins' or whatever we (whites) are called or any race for that matter. I guess it is because I know who I am and am proud of it. Therefore no name calling or utilization of my ethnic background by any organization can offend me, because that is not who I am on the inside.
Besides, my blood runs with the blood many, many different
races and even though several members of my family have tried, we have never been able to narrow it down to any one prominent race. My skin is very light (almost opaque), my hair is a curly blonde (albeit dark blonde), and my eyes are green w/golden flakes. Is that who I am? Of course not. Yet, even despite my appearance I have no true race I belong to, as races go. I am simply 'White' and American born and raised.
Keeping that in mind,I cannot help but feel pride in the fact that a sports team has chosen to use my 'color' or race, if 'white' is even a race, which I hope it is since that is all I am, as a team mascot. It kinda puts all of us who have multiple ethnic backgrounds, but are considered just 'White', in the same group as the 'Notre Dame Fighting Irish', 'The Dallas Cowboys', 'The Ragin Cajuns in Louisiana' and 'The Redskins'.
In all honesty, I hope the 'Fighting Whities' kick the pants off all their competition and I am buying one of the t-shirts and will wear it proudly in support of my new favorite team. I would like to get pictures of the players, so if anyone has team pictures let me know. |
|
about time |
by Ali
thwwarrior (nospam) hotmail.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
19 Mar 2002
|
|
i'm very proud of you guys for having the guts to stand up against an injustice thats been heaped upon the native americans. as a black man in this country i fully understand the lack of respect that the caucasion community shows nearly every other culture including their own. |
|
Finally |
by Liv
me_just_me (nospam) hotmail.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
19 Mar 2002
|
|
I am a white woman who grew up on the Rosebud Reservation in South Central South Dakota. I think that this makes a great statement. For years my family has fought against the usage of Native Americans as mascots. When we moved to New York in 1991 the town's mascot was the Redskins and they had some guy dressed in what they thought was traditional regalia holding a tomahawk and a jug of "fire water." It horrendous to see this after living on a reservation for most of your life. I think that this is just what is needed to open some people's eyes about this topic. If anyone wants to, they can email me and use "Fighting Whites" as the subject. |
|
"Go Whities" |
by Doc Murphy
redchouli14 (nospam) aol.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
19 Mar 2002
|
Go Fightin Whities!
If these kids have 1/2 as much game as they do guts
they will certainly be a #1 contender on the court!
I pray this high esteem for social values these young men show now follow them through the rest of their lives as well.May they always find inward peace as they fight a worthy battle. |
|
Good Idea |
by Jared Bezet
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 3
19 Mar 2002
|
I think the mascot is a great idea. I'm a white male and I think it's the best thing I've seen in a long time.
Lots of people are saying that the name "Reds" is a way to pay tribute and respect to a minority group. I disagree. The term was coined as a derogatory and insulting designation for a minority group back when white people were killing them off and stealing their land. The word is a lingering artifact of disrespect. It's disturbing that here we have a blatantly racist term and people don't even realize it. They think it's a term of respect that glorifies the warlike and proud culture of Native Americans. Do any of these people realize that killing each other in tribal conflict was NOT the only thing that Native Americans spent their time doing?
Lots of people are also saying, "I'm white and I'm not offended by the mascot." No one should be offended because the "Fighting Whities" isn't meant to be offensive; it was a means of starting a dialogue, which it has done with ringing succes. Racism is still rampant across the nation and it needs to be discussed. The issue is much bigger than whether mascots need to be politically correct or not.
This conversation doesn't need to be about labels of "liberals" or "conservatives" or "left-wing" or "right-wing," or political correctness. It needs to be about how all people are human beings and some people don't treat other people like human beings because of stupid and arbitrary conditions like the color of skin or their country of origin.
People should be decent to each other. Name-calling and spite don't accomplish that.
I'm going to order one of these shirts and proudly wear it in the spirit in which it was intended: humorous and ironic satire of a culture that thinks that simply because democracy operates on the opinion of the majority that the opinion of the minority doesn't count for anything.
These kids at UNC realize this. The rest of the nation needs to catch up. |
|
LOVE IT! |
by LaVerne Glaze
laverneglaze (nospam) hotmail.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
19 Mar 2002
|
|
This is just too good and if the t-shirts make money for scholarships for native Americans..Go for it!!! |
|
I LOVE IT |
by Glenn Stubbs
glenn_stubbs (nospam) hotmail.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
19 Mar 2002
|
|
I absolutely love the idea of the Fightin' Whites. I'm ordering a t-shirt. Don't worry - every thang's going to be all white. |
|
Apples and Oranges |
by kevin keeffe
maklou (nospam) earthlink.net (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
19 Mar 2002
|
The the motivation behind the naming of the team is entirely different than how a normal team name is chosen.
Team names are typically chosen for things that encite a feeling of pride, passion, high energy, ferociousness, cunning, etc....
This team name was chosen out of spite :o( and maliciousness and thus the point will go wide. To me this borders on a hate crime, though the humor is well pointed and I think I will buy a hat and t-shirt and wear them both with pride. |
|
proud |
by kirk
kstivers2000 (nospam) yahoo.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
20 Mar 2002
|
I'm proud to be white and the contribution white society
has given to the world. Keep up the good work. Why should
all of these other people find everything offensive? |
|
Humor Heals |
by gary conner
gconner (nospam) kent.edu (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
20 Mar 2002
|
To the superintendant of the Greely Colorado school system;"How strange that a white male would find it offensive when HIS offensive behavior is called into question by those being offended!" How dare people use sensitivity, caring and a good bit of humor to call into question an obviously racist practice. As a person who has facilitated discussions, presented seminars and offered keynote addresses regarding this very topic, I can tell you I am pleased that the students and staff have found a way to open some debate and hopefully promote some bit of learning on the harm of institutionally stereotyping people.
The very manner that the superintendant delivers his response proves that stereotyping is offensive; why he seems to feel that when his group does it, it is ok is beyond the scope of my understanding. Could it be because as a white male he is able to live a priveleged life in a country built on the backs of others? Could it be because, although we all know Americans do not "own" slaves today, most of the priveleges still exist that began and became institutionalized during and due to slavery. Maybe it is because he just does not understand and is not willing to give up hhis position of power for the good of his community, of all our communities. How selfish! How sad!
Keep up the great work, Fighting Whities! I and many others are with you in spirit, words and deeds. We will win one day. Then, as Langston Hughes said, "....they'll see how beautiful I am....and be ashamed."
(By the way, I, too, am a "fighting whitie"....literally and figuratively!)
Gary S. Conner |
|
Backfire |
by Keith Platt
kplatt (nospam) uniformcomponents.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
20 Mar 2002
|
|
I think this whole campaign will backfire on them. I think people who are offended by masscotts need to get a life. And I think this "Fighting Whites" idea illustrates that point. I am a white guy and I think it's funny. Why should the "Cleveland Indians" bother a native american any more than the "Fighting Whites" bothers me? When I first heard this story that's the point I thought they were trying to make. |
|
White jersey |
by Bob Lorenzen
chebob1 (nospam) mchsi.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
20 Mar 2002
|
Please if you will, let me know how I can purchase one of the shirts.
Thanks,
Bob Lorenzen
Davenport, Iowa |
|
Fighting Whities |
by DeLonna Wissert
dwissert (nospam) ralee.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
20 Mar 2002
|
Let me start by saying I am Cherokee and Scotch-Irish, not that it should matter, but somehow I think it does.
I don't understand why people get upset when a team name reflects a certain "people" or "place" or "symbol". Who would name their team after something they didn't like...it is an honor to have a team want to carry your name, symbol or ethnic beliefs. Everyone involved loves the team and supports it, how is that a bad thing?
I hope the "Fighting Whities" sell lot's of shirts and raise lot's of money for the scholarships.
DeLonna |
|
Fighting Whites |
by DJ McClure
chahta_ndn_girl01 (nospam) redpride.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
20 Mar 2002
|
|
Good for them!! Its about time this topic got some serious attention!! I give talks here at my university (University of Louisville, Kentucky) and I am thrilled to see this! I am ordering my sweatshirt this week to support the Fightin Whites!!! GO TEAM!!! |
|
Yeah |
by Zach Dozier
zeke_isa_vitamin (nospam) yahoo.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
20 Mar 2002
|
|
I think this is awsome. I am white and I think that this is a very strong political statement being made here. We took their land we can't get mad for this. |
|
where to get t shirt |
by teresa
itzmet (nospam) aol.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
20 Mar 2002
|
They set up an email address for orders and info
fightingwhities (at) hotmail.com |
|
web address for t shirts |
by teresa
itzmet (nospam) aol.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
20 Mar 2002
|
here is the web address to order t shirts, hats ect
www.cafepress.com/fightinwhite |
|
Fighting Whitie jersey |
by Meredith Raney
meredithraney (nospam) msn.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
20 Mar 2002
|
|
I want to buy one of these Fighting Whitie jerseys. Where can I order one? |
|
I think your right |
by Travis Rastetter
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
20 Mar 2002
|
|
I agree one hundred percent; we should not be using Native American names for our sports teams. I mean the Indians lost, we kicked there butts all over the place, and we were out numbered. Why should we honor them by naming our sports teams after them? Why would we name our teams after a bunch of crybaby losers? We might as well name our teams after the Taliban, Iraq or even worse, the French (another bunch of crybaby losers). Let’s quit honoring these people with courageous sports names like Braves and Warriors, and name our sports teams after winners, not whiners. |
|
Chips |
by Frank Black
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
20 Mar 2002
|
Too many people in this country running around with chips
on their shoulders. Get a life. |
|
T-shirts |
by Myrna
carnahanva (nospam) yahoo.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
20 Mar 2002
|
Does anyone know the website where you can get Fighting Whitey t-shirts?
Thanks |
|
Lighten Up |
by sdb9958
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
20 Mar 2002
|
|
I thought the whole point of selecting a mascot and nickname was to identify your team/organization with admirable qualities such as strength, tenacity, glory, honor, a fearsome presence and tradition. Hence the use of names of powerful and noble animals, traditionally strong fighters, or triumphant groups of people. While there are several that do not fit this definition, I find it difficult to believe that any organization, except maybe a group of clowns from the Barnum and Bailey Circus, would knowingly choose or intend to degrade or humiliate their group, or associate their name with a degrading or humiliating label. The clowns may do it to be funny. Which clowns are. The perception is always in the eyes of the perceiver and America needs to lighten up. Stop seeing disrespect at every turn. Be self-confident enough to instead see, look for and recognize honor and respect. We've become a nation of cry babies. It's time to grow up. It's just the name of a team, jeez. |
|
Thanks |
by R.J. Stringer
rjstringer (nospam) yahoo.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
20 Mar 2002
|
|
Thanks for the sanity check. Very Cool! |
|
wonderful name |
by m.laskowski
vegasrams (nospam) aol.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
20 Mar 2002
|
|
just thought send an e-mail expressing my appriciation of the new team name I think it is one of the most original names i have ever heard thanks for the good laugh and please don't change the name, thank you again the biggest FIGHTING WHITIES FAN |
|
Stereotypes of whites |
by Chuck Douglas
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
20 Mar 2002
|
As a German-American first let me say that I am offended at being lumped in with all other white people. The ethnic group known as "whities" is really made up of many distinct cultures and each of those groups deserves it's own identity and politically correct terms.
I for one am fighting to preserve my own family's unique German/Dutch/Polish/Russian/English heritage and resent being lumped into one generic group with other Americans who may be Irish-Americans, Welsh-Americans or even French-Americans. To lump us all together and call us "whities" is to stereotype us, is just another form of bigotry, and demeans my own rich cultural heritage which must be preserved through art, culture, and bland cooking.
My own family was driven from Germany and then Russia a century ago. Our lands were stolen, our people killed or imprisoned. I am hoping one day that this grave injustice against my forbearers will be corrected through reparations to be paid by the governments of Germany and Russia.
In the mean time I believe all sports teams should be given inoffensive names such as "Fightin' Generic Persons" "Really Nice Sports Players." Animal names such as "Dolphins" or "Mustangs" cannot be used as they are speciest and might suggest that an animal is less than equal to a human. Plant names such as "Mighty Fightin' Oaks" should be avoided as we do not wish to encourage the destruction of nature to create souvenirs.
In the absence of a true willingness on the part of all Americans to offend absolutely no one perhaps we should all just learn to stop taking ourselves so seriously. |
|
I'm white and I love it! |
by Whitey
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
20 Mar 2002
|
|
I'm white and I love the mascot! Go go Fighting Whites! |
|
Great Name! |
by Greg Penn, Rockville, Maryland
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
20 Mar 2002
|
|
All my life I've wondered why names of teams, contests, clubs, political caucuses, etc., don't ever reflect the white ethnicity. The "Fightin' Whiteys" rights this wrong! Next-- let's have things like a Miss White America contest, a Congressional White Caucus, and a White College Fund. Thanks to the team for being bold enough to challenge the "ethnic glass ceiling" for white men and women. |
|
Savage Solution & Common Ground |
by Jack Ass
jack (nospam) andiass.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
20 Mar 2002
|
Savage Solution
In our little town of Hot Springs
the name Savages labels our school team,
in a place of education and scholars
there are some that don’t know what it means.
Webster’s has many definitions
for this unruly name,
none of them refer to sports
or any other children’s games.
Inhuman, rude and cruel
is that what children should mirror?
uncivilized, murderous and barbarous
is “normal” for those who want to rule by fear.
To some Native Tribal members
it reminds them of the painful past,
also of the horrendous crimes done to them
and once you know your emotions do aghast.
Now we know the problem
and a solution we should choose,
let’s start with finding a new name
one of which gives lasting truce.
Maybe we should find some humor
to enlighten our heavy load,
life can give us many curves
along our sometimes darkened road.
This name could resemble an animal
of the surest feet and mind,
the most mentioned in the Bible
a legend before its time.
Portraying the highest values,
and stubborn to the core,
won’t put themselves in peril
how could we ask for more.
This name will send the message
above all the other classes,
standing strong and standing firm
let’s call our team, the Hot Springs Jackasses.
Common Ground
Divide and conquer is one plan
for those with motives far from pure,
they have forgotten the circle of life
the one true law we know for sure.
If we create a win / win
no one has to lose,
thus ending many battles of life
no higher ground there is to choose.
When searching for solutions
upon which we all agree,
we find ourselves on common ground
and joined in unity. |
|
TOO FUNNY! |
by Mike Boworn
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
20 Mar 2002
|
|
I'm a "whitey" and I think it is hillarious. The school administrator that was all upset about it should "drink a beer and get over it!" |
|
GO WHITEY GO! |
by Emily
paroxysm_6969 (nospam) yahoo.com (unverified) |
Current rating: -1
20 Mar 2002
|
|
I DEFINITELY SUPPORT THE FIGHTIN' WHITES. WE NEED TO SHOW WHITE PEOPLE THAT WE CAN MAKE OFF THEM MUCH LIKE THEY HAVE MADE MONEY OFF OTHER MINORITIES. |
|
Re: :the Fighting Whities: |
by opeyemi adesina gabriel
fleflek (nospam) hotmail.com,fleflek (nospam) netscape.net (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
05 Mar 2003
Modified: 07:00:01 PM |
|
I will like to join you,aand to more about it. |
|
Re: :the fighting whities: |
by Heather
ks_angel_1 (nospam) yahoo.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
18 Feb 2004
|
|
I think it is as fair as any other ethnic moniker given to a sports team, Whites should be no more upset than any other ethnic group,who has their heritage used as a name or sports mascot.We as whites should take it in strides the same way many native americans do. We are no diffrent. I find it amusing it has taken so long for someone to come up with one. |
|
Re: :the fighting whities: |
by It's a human thang...
1234 (nospam) hotmail.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
08 May 2004
|
First of all, yes, I am White. And second of all, yes, there was a time when I believed the dominate thinking that Whites somehow have a tendancy toward racism that other races of people do not have. Haven't we had this theory repeated over and over again since the 1960's? Our kids learn it during Black History Month, Hispanic American Week, Asian American Month, etc., etc.
That was before I moved to Asia where when I walk down the street I am stared at and talked about as I pass by. And no, it's not because I am American because I am asked if I am American, European or Canadian. Sometimes, I am even touched and my hair rubbed as if I am not a thinking, feeling human being.
So I understand know that racism is a "human thang". We inherently identify with our own race and see other races as somehow different. The "Fighting Whities" proves that point as well. |
|
Re: :the fighting whities: |
by David George
HSCRyder (nospam) yahoo.com (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
25 Sep 2004
|
|
FOR CRYING OUT LOAD!... It's WHITIES!!!! Not Whites. THE FIGHTING WHIT-IES!!! Thats what makes it funny. I get their point and its brilliant and humorous. Hell, I'd be their mascot if they wanted me to. Of course I'm bald on top, with long curly brown hair and a goatee. Maybe I'm not a good judge of whats fair though. I never had my land taken from me by force or shady invalid treaties. No one ever told me to stop hunting and start farming in sand either. |
|
What about Southerners? |
by Andrew
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
03 Nov 2005
|
|
Some moron said that white people are "priviledged" because they've never been disrepected for generations. This person has conveniently forgotten that it's currently the trend to make fun of southerners (black or white) as rednecks and oafs and simpletons. I still would not be offended if they made mascots for the south in, say, the north. In fact, I'd applaud it. |
|
