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A Billion Things Wrong With War |
Current rating: 3 |
by Joshua Sloan
Email: jsloan60 (nospam) cox.net (unverified!) |
05 Mar 2003
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(my latest rant) |
The insanity of the whole Bush Jr. war thing has been boggling my mind! The military action in Iraq is projected to cost $100 BILLION. (Of course spread over 4 months.) Not counting the millions (billions?) in bribes we've got to pay Iraq's neighbors, and our patsies...err, henchmen...err, allies. Isn't that more than enough to just BUY all of Saddam's weapons and military off, and then build houses and schools for all Iraqis? It’s a lot more than we paid to him when he did our bidding years ago. If we had spent $5 BILLION of that, spread over the last 10 years on building goodwill, we may not have got ourselves into this position. But $100 Billion is still cheaper that he cost of the 1980's (http://www.fdic.gov/bank/analytical/banking/2000dec/brv13n2_2.pdf) Savings and Loan scandal. Oh wait that was a different Bush (Jed). Seems easy to confuse them. All old oil moneymen right?
Our reactionary answer to tough issues always seems to be to throw money and weapons at the problem at the last minute. No wonder so many countries distrust us, I distrust us. And most of our new enemies seem to be old CIA employees. Once they're off the payroll, they always come back to haunt us. They really know how to pick friends, don't they? Thanks ex-CIA director Bush Sr. You contributed to and passed on this time "honored" practice.
More war-related news from the region...there's supposed to be a bumper crop of poppies in Afghanistan this year. The conditions of desperate refugees aggravated (caused?) by our actions there, left the poor with few other options. Think the US gov't /military/CIA will be about to change that cultural legacy/domestic nightmare? Don't count on it. There's BILLIONS more political value and money to be made fighting it at home. And the whole crop can't be worth more than $4 billion...Would bet a BILLION bucks that in 10 yrs we'll find out that Afghanistan became another Iran/Contra affair in a new suit. We never learn.
Our own government's laws and policies have resulted in more deaths and despair within our own borders, than most other countries. Its just that we kill most of our citizens very slowly, over 2-3 decades, so no one notices, and few care. Pacify. Subjugate. Denigrate. Destroy. The more things change, the more they stay the same. Watch as the Religious Right, wrongly marches in goose step with the perpe-traitors of intolerance, war, and death. Whatever its form, warfare is never fair, cheap, or easy to swallow. If I had a choice, I'd choose peace. Unfortunately, most leaders just want SHEEP, but true patriotism means caring enough to want to change things.
The truest test of strength is the ability to care, too bad our leaders care for violence over peace.
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Comments
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Josh - A Billion Things Wrong With War |
by Jack Ryan
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 1
05 Mar 2003
Modified: 11:20:38 PM |
Josh,
By your writing style, I am assuming that you are a product of our American Public School educational system. From the points that you have laid out, I am sure that you have taken several courses in history from under-motivated teachers who think that money they make for 180 days work is too little.
You mention a billion reasons for not going to war, yet you list about 20. Math is important Josh. You'll need when you are poisoning the minds of the children who are forced to attend the same schools you did.
Josh, when we dig up the mass graves of the Iraqis who opposed Saddam, what kind of shitfit will you have then? When the flowers bounce off our tanks as they roll through downtown Bagdad, will you be man enough to wish you were there? I assume that you will simply change your focus on how many government handouts you are not receiving.
Anyway Josh, I suggest you, quickly, get a book in grammar and teach yourself how to read and write. History, we can work on later.
Your Friend,
Jack |
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Re: A Billion Things Wrong With War |
by RDR
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
08 Mar 2003
Modified: 10:34:51 PM |
Saddam has killed thousands and some say millions. I know this and still believe the war is wrong. If it is so bad for Saddam kills his political opponents, why is it ok for the US to kill Iraqis through sanctions to "motivate" them to get rid of our political opponent, Saddam. Isn't the shock and awe, Daisy Cutter II, bombing, going to create mass graves larger than any Saddam is rumored to have.
And of course there will be Iraqis happy to see us come. But will it be a glimmer of hope in their eyes or the realization that they had better suck up to their new master, the United States. Any hope will nontheless fade because when it comes to rebuilding iraq, we all of a sudden won't have the money because (note sarcasm) by golly you know the rick need tax relief.
I agree with Joshua.
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Re: A Billion Things Wrong With War |
by Rev Dave
DarkMatter (nospam) Hypocrisy.org (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
09 Mar 2003
Modified: 05:19:39 PM |
Dear Jack,
Josh stated that the above was his "latest rant". A rant is generally understood to be a free-flowing stream of thought that's all about substance, not form.
You, sir, seem to be a prouduct of the educational system described in the commentary posted to the newswire entitled Learning To Be Stupid In A Culture of Cash. Check it out, you may find it contains a thought or two that may provoke you to go off on a rant.
Excelsior, Rev Dave |
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RDR/and The Rev Dave |
by Jack Ryan
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
10 Mar 2003
Modified: 11:07:18 AM |
Have the US sanctions imposed upon Iraq caused death. Whose fault is that? If Saddam would have simply complied with the terms outlined the Cease Fire and disarmed TWELVE YEARS AGO, I would argue that we would not have to kick his ass yet again.
As for the Daisy Cutter II, yeah that's going to scatter the Iraqis who survive it and force them to surrender to unmanned airplanes and news crews just like in Desert Storm. This is a good thing as they then will not be able shoot their eventual liberators ( The US Military ) you know the good guys.
All of this could be avoided if Saddam would surrender or leave the country or if the world would unite behind the President.
You indicate that the Iraqis, upon being soundly defeated will then have to kiss up to there new master (The US). With all due respect RDR, since when have any of our defeated enemies ever sucked up to us? I suppose if this were true, Germany would be voting with us at the worthless institution called the UN. The future Iraq will be an oasis of Democracy in a land surrounded by tyrants and dictators. Freedom will spread and former enemies will become trading partners.
As for the Tax Cut being delayed as a result of the rebuilding of Iraq, this will not nor should it happen. The government already takes 40 percent of what I make and calls it fair. When taxes are cut, the economy grows each and everytime it is tried. Dispute that!!! You guys will continue to receive your handouts. I have promised this in other posts. It would seem you fear that you and your cohorts may actually have to go out and get a job or something. Relax dude.
Now for the this man of god, the honorable Rev. Dave. You must be a Reverend in the Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton class. Hey thanks for defining rant "stream of thought that's all about substance". It was a stream, alright, but I would question the validty of this as "thought".
Thanks for recommending "Learning to be Stupid in a Culture of Cash". I see by your comments that you have completely mastered the lesson.
God Bless,
Jack
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Re: A Billion Things Wrong With War |
by Rev Dave
DarkMatter (nospam) Hypocrisy.org (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
10 Mar 2003
Modified: 01:01:06 PM |
Dear Jack Ryan,
You really should read the commentary.
And, yes indeed, I'm an ordained minister with a master's degree in religious studies. (not from Bob Jones "University") I'm not a supporter of Al Sharpton and/or Jesse Jackson--not against either. But why not group me with Jerry Falwell, Pat Robertson and the Grahams? You aren't a bigot, are you Jack Ryan?
You're invited to my next snake-handling service--bring a covered dish.
Peace, Rev Dave |
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Rev Dave |
by Jack Ryan
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
10 Mar 2003
Modified: 02:24:52 PM |
Playing the race card already Dave, now is this a Christian Attitude. Last time I checked Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson were out providing aid and comfort to our enemies while the other ministers mentioned have consistently supported the President and our troops. Clearly race had nothing to do with this.
While we are on the subject, I am certain that if Jesus had met up with these two, he would have thrown these money changers out of the temple on their collective ears.
Thanks for the invitation to the snake handling session, but in my religion that is considered a sin. You boys have fun though.
And Also With You,
Jack
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Re: A Billion Things Wrong With War |
by Rev Dave
DarkMatter (nospam) Hypocrisy.org (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
10 Mar 2003
Modified: 03:08:37 PM |
Dear Jack Ryan,
Moi, playing the race card? Thought that was you, oh well. It's interesting that you assume only "boys" participate in the snake-handlings. And, speaking of money changers, what do you suppose Jesus de Cristo would make of your boys Falwell, Robertson, et al?
You really should read the commentary entitled Learning To Be Stupid in The Culture of Cash, really. The author provides an e-mail address, I'm sure she'd be, um, let's say entertained by your feedback.
Kind regards, Rev Dave |
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Rev Dave |
by Jack Ryan
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
10 Mar 2003
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Co ed snake handling is a little different. In fact, my nickname in high school was Anaconda. In any case, I am going to read the "Stupid Article". I sense a trap, however. As for Falwel and Robertson etc. I really do not have much use for them either except that they are pro-Bush as am I.
Take Care,
Jack |
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Re: A Billion Things Wrong With War |
by Rev Dave
DarkMatter (nospam) Hypocrisy.org (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
10 Mar 2003
Modified: 04:15:15 PM |
Dear Jack Ryan,
Suggesting that you read the commentary is not a trap. I honestly hope you find it thought-provoking, if not enlightening.
It's encouraging that you have no use for Falwell, Robertson, et al. There's an interesting book on the taking up of serpents which you might enjoy--Salvation On Sand Mountain by Dennis Covington. Those wild and crazy serpent taker-uppers come in both genders and sure do get down to the raw elements of faith, dont they?
While I've somewhat enjoyed our little exchange, don't you think if we wish to continue it's time we took it to the personal e-mail forum? But maybe we should chill as this has to be taking time away from your FreeRepublic.com discussions and I've got the work of my one pretty true church to do.
Wishing you the very best.
Excelsior, Rev Dave |
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Thanks For The Recommendation Rev Dave |
by Jack Ryan
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
10 Mar 2003
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Dave,
Thanks for the recommendation. I love spending my afternoon listening to yet another, American Hating, Know it all, commie, professor who laments the educational system set up and destroyed by the very people she most likely supports. Unfortunately, she and her kind have become a cliche for professors all over the country.
Know any good Restaurants? |
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Re: A Billion Things Wrong With War |
by Rev Dave
DarkMatter (nospam) Hypocrisy.org (unverified) |
Current rating: 0
10 Mar 2003
Modified: 04:47:14 PM |
Dear Jack Ryan,
Restaurants? Yeah, check out Mama's Royal Cafe in Oakland, CA.
But, alas Jack Ryan, it seems we have about as much chance of having a thoughtful exchange as our little prince pretzelbreath has of rating any higher than #43 on Helen Thomas' list of great presidents.
Let's just chill.
Have fun, take care, be cool, see ya later, bye.
Rev Dave |
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Re: A Billion Things Wrong With War |
by Joshua Sloan
jsloan60 (nospam) cox.net (unverified) |
Current rating: 3
10 Mar 2003
Modified: 10:00:30 PM |
Apologies. My 'latest rant' was admittedly poor grammar, having been written in the wee hours of the morning, that and the fact that web forms don't do 'spell checks'. And I think you miss understood me just a bit. I am NOT anti-American, in fact I DO care enough about this multicultural nation to voice dissent when it hurts my heart and sensibilities. But I know that greatness comes not by force, but by true caring.
I sought not to change the minds of those who wear a Red White and Blue Blindfold, but rather to express my discontent with the level of intolerance and hate which has occurred and continues to occur in THIS country. Not all of my history teachers, were underpaid, disgruntled lefties either, as you imply. Nor do I believe the historical whitewash presented by mainstream media. If you wish to disagree with my historical facts, please do so in an intelligent manner. We do have a history of cultural supremacy and megalomania unsurpassed my any small dictator, anywhere. I am also thankful that I won’t be shot for my dissent (at least not yet!), but a redneck “Love it or Leave it” attitude just won’t wash with me. If we don’t learn from our historical mistakes, how will we ever change? I for one would prefer if we didn’t work so hard to create a militarized, paranoid Orwellian self-fulfilling prophecy.
My BILLIONs of reasons Against War reference was to the CASH, silly, although I can think of a few more... I’m not against religion either, just those that perpetrates crimes in the name of some moral high ground. Jesus would probably turn in his grave if he knew all the wars and death committed in his name! Its no wonder that our children grow up thinking violence is the answer to tough problems. What kind of examples do they have? War-mongering costs more than money, it costs us the respect of civilized countries around the world. And dooms our children to make the same mistakes. Might DOES NOT make right.
While I picked on the Bushes, it was only to make a point of how much this one family has cost the average taxpayer. Savings-n-Loan bailout and two expensive wars are just a couple examples. Don’t think I am a “Liberal” either; I see very little distinction between the two major parties.
As for digging up the mass graves of Iraqis to prove “We were right” how many will we have to dig in order to get that far? Assuredly, life could be better for the typical Iraqi if Saddam were gone, but by acting unilaterally we are creating the next generation of martyrs as a legacy for future Americans. What if China and the Soviets decider to do the same??? Would you just turn a blind eye?
The problems we face as nations are the same problems we have with each other as individuals, just magnified many times over. If we could take care of each other, we wouldn’t need cops or laws or armies to do it for us. Of course that’s like saying if common sense were common, everyone would have it. I don’t believe in handouts, but how about a ‘hand up’? I know it’s a bit idealistic, but I’d rather try to be a visionary, than a vicious missionary of corrupt capitalism. Puppet governments only remain subservient as long as we hold all the strings. I DO respect your right to disagree with me (can you say the same?)
Spellchecked, spellbound, and respectfully yours,
Joshua Sloan
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Welcome Back Josh |
by Jack Ryan
(No verified email address) |
Current rating: 0
11 Mar 2003
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Hey, it's me Jack
Of course I can respect your opinion and when I have more time, I am going to make sure that I respond to you in a respectful manner. But one thing I can't let go. You said "Jesus would probably turn in his grave if he knew all the wars and death committed in his name! Josh, Christ has risen, go out and spread the Good News.
I'll be in touch,
Jack |
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